00:00:00 Fokion Burgess: Umm, so, my name is Fokion Burgess and I'm interviewing Lynn Ho. Um, it's October Twenty-Seventh, Wednesday October Twenty-Seventh at about Five after Eight PM. Um, so basically I guess we'll start from the beginning, um, where were you born?
00:00:21 Lynn Ho: I was born in Yonkers, New York.
00:00:26 FB: Did you have any siblings?
00:00:30 LH: Well, there's my sister Kay, who you just met, and a brother, John.
00:00:34 LUCAS: Don't forget about me!
00:00:37 LH: You're not a sibling.
00:00:39 FB: What did your parents do?
00:00:41 LH: Um, my father was a Chemist, and then he couldn't find a job after a while so he ended up working with his brother who had his own business in Chinatown. So they had a trucking company, real estate, a bean sprout factory. They were very diversified. They had a big empire going there.
00:01:06 FB: Cool, did—was your mother, did your mother not work?
00:01:10 LH: My mom always worked. She was—she was a nurse, she finished her, her bachelor's when I was in high school. A year before I graduated she got her bachelor's from—is it Lehman?—Lehman College, in the Bronx, and then, she started studying for her, her master's, she didn't, she never completed that, but she always worked full-time, took care of the house, and also went to school.
00:01:41 FB: Wow, that's really impressive.
00:01:42 LH: She was quite impressive, yeah. For her, for that generation. Yeah we didn't have... no stay at home moms here.
00:01:51 FB: So umm, so when did you umm, so what kind of high school did you go to?
00:01:56 LH: I went to the public high school, in Yonkers. Yonkers has—do you know Yonkers at all?
00:02:03 FB: No, I don't know New York very well.
00:02:04 LH: Yonkers is sort of, it's just north of the Bronx. It's pretty much a bedroom community, and it's umm, it's actually, it's pretty much the armpit of Westchester county, which is the wealthy suburb north of New York City. And actually it's becoming, a friend of mine went down there just recently and said that it's becoming gentrified. There's this place called Getty's square which is very very, like the very center of the armpit [Both Laugh] and it's actually getting bought up and made into these little stuffy boutiques, which is really shocking because it was always extremely poor, um it was, um, people of color and Hispanics and you couldn't walk down there for quite some time without feeling just like watch what you were doing, so, yeah Yonkers is changing.
00:02:50 FB: Wow
00:02:52 LH: You know, so, Princeton is not quite the same as it..
00:02:56 FB: [Laugh] No, it's pretty much the same as it's always been. Umm, so umm, did you go directly to Brown after high school?
00:03:08 LH: I did, yeah, I went to Brown, umm... shocking they let me in there.
00:03:13 [Both Laugh]
00:03:16 LH: And, actually now that I think about it I wonder why they took me because my SAT scores were sort of on the lower side and I certainly, I don't think I was distinguished in any way, so [laughs] I guess they needed some people, like some diversity. Who knows, I don't know.
00:03:36 FB: What year was that?
00:03:37 LH: I got in, umm, in '76 and I graduated, I was class of '80 but I graduated class of '81, 'cause I took off a year, to, hang around.
00:03:46 FB: Which year did you take off?
00:03:46 LH: Junior.
00:03:47 FB: So, what would have been your Junior year?
00:03:49 LH: Yes.
00:03:49 FB: Okay.
00:03:50 LH: Well, I eventually went back and did it.
00:03:52 FB: Yeah. [Laughs]
00:03:53 LH: I eventually did graduate.
00:03:55 FB: Yes. So it was the year after you took off that you joined, that you joined...
00:04:01 LH: No, I was in the co-ops my sophomore...
00:04:05 FB: Sophomore year. So, how did you find out about them?
00:04:08 LH: No, actually, now how did that work, I can't remember, I think, I think it was my sophomore year. No no no, that's not true, my sophomore year, thank you for reminding me, was, I lived in Sod house. You know where Sod house is?
00:04:22 FB: Mm-mm.
00:04:22 LH: Maybe you don't have it anymore, it's, right next to the Fox Point Daycare, you know where that is?
00:04:28 FB: I think so.
00:04:29 LH: You know where Loui's is?
00:04:30 FB: Yeah.
00:04:31 LH: If you keep walking up the street there, there's that daycare center. Right next to it is, used to be a yellow house. A very ornate house on the corner, called Solidarity House. So I was there when I was a sophomore. And then I took a year off and I came back after that year and, uh, my friends were all living in the co-ops. So that's where I lived.
00:04:51 FB: So it was the year that you came back that you...
00:04:53 LH: It must have been my junior year, yeah.
00:04:55 FB: Okay, so umm, you lived in Millhouse.
00:04:59 LH: I lived in Millhouse, yeah.
00:05:00 FB: For the whole year?
00:05:02 LH: Yes.
00:05:04 FB: So how was it?
00:05:05 LH: Well, you know, it was, umm, it was not very clean. Is actually my overrunning impression is, impression is that it was not very clean. But it was a great place to live. It was, it was very much out on the Left, as the co-ops are now. Um, and lots of wacky, lots of wacky people. But, you know, it was a great crew of people, those people I still hang with they're still my best friends.
00:05:30 FB: Oh cool, so what, um, what was it that, that turned you to them?
00:05:37 LH: My friends.
00:05:39 FB: Just your friends.
00:05:40 LH: Yeah, you know how, um, the oil has to stay with the oil. I think it was that, that crew, that, that Left-hanging crew.
00:05:52 FB: So umm, describe how—could you describe how the co-ops worked? At least, when you were there.
00:05:58 LH: There were three co-ops at that time, there was Watermyn, Millhouse, and, what was the other one?
00:06:04 FB: Carberry.
00:06:05 LH: There was Carberry, yes, the one down the street from Millhouse. They were, there was BACH, as it exists now, umm, there was a lot of squabble with the University, as it, is it still going on now?
00:06:20 FB: Um it's, right now there's sort of, there's not too much going on between BACH and the University.
00:06:28 LH: There was always the threat of the close-down for, various violations, most of them must have been sanitary.
00:06:35 [Both Laugh]
00:06:37 LH: Um, hmm, yeah, it was, it was a cheap place to live, umm, the food was, was—do you guys still cook?
00:06:47 FB: Mm-hm
00:06:48 LH: The food was... better, from my point of view, because it wasn't at the dorms or the cafeteria.
00:06:55 LUCAS: Don't forget about Spike's!
00:06:55 LH: I didn't go to Spike's; they didn't have Spike's back then.
00:06:58 LUCAS: Darn.
[Phone ringing in background.]
00:06:59 LH: No Spikes back then.
00:07:00 LUCAS: They have Spikes now.
[Phone still ringing]
00:07:03 LH: Is it okay if we—
00:07:04 FB: Yeah yeah yeah.
00:07:05 [Interview clipped during phone call.]
00:07:06 LH: Sorry.
00:07:06 FB: No, that's fine.
00:07:08 FB: So, umm... where were we? We were, umm...
00:07:12 LH: We were talking about umm, the general structure of the co-op. So, three co-ops, I didn't actually do any of the, any of the administrative stuff.
00:07:27 FB: Oh, okay.
00:07:29 LH: I don't exactly know what the organization was. How is it now?
00:07:33 FB: Umm...
00:07:34 LH: There's just two co-ops, right?
00:07:35 FB: Yeah there's, umm, Finlandia and Watermyn. Because they, they took back Millhouse and Carberry.
00:07:45 LH: Because of fire stuff?
00:07:47 FB: Umm... I mean, I wasn't around then, but it was, basically, looking for any excuse they could to, to try and shut down the co-ops.
00:07:56 LH: Why do they want to shut us down? Except for the sanitary reasons.
00:08:01 FB: Umm, but, the plus side is that now both the co-ops, neither of them are owned by Brown so they can't shut us down.
00:08:15 LH: The buildings they were both, all three of them were owned by Brown... those buildings?
00:08:20 FB: Watermyn was never owned by Brown. And the new house, Finlandia is not owned by Brown.
00:08:28 LH: Where'd you guys get enough money to buy those houses?
00:08:32 FB: Umm... I don't know.
00:08:37 LH: That's interesting.
00:08:42 FB: So, in your email you said, um, that you were sort of living, in a cloud, back then, what exactly did you mean–
00:08:55 LH: Well, I think that's a typical–now I see it now because I'm forty-something, but to me, um, and I'm also working at the University. I work at their health services.
00:09:05 FB: Oh!
00:09:05 LH: It's just– not at Brown, at URI. It's just that age, when you're that age you're so... [Sigh] Well, it's idealism, and it's also a complete lack of reality. Maybe you don't, you probably don't know what I'm talking about yet, but, it's just that young age. It's great, I mean, when I just look at the kids I think, these kids are really great, but they have no clue. Like when you called that you were coming, I said, you know, now that sounds great but, is he really going to take the bus here? And how's he going to get home?
00:09:44 [Both laugh]
00:09:45 LH: Did he even thing about how he's going to get home? So, it's that kind of thing, what your mother would say. Yeah, I'm my mother, or something like that. Yeah, so, I was in a cloud. Things are so important to you when it turns out, they're actually really not that important.
00:10:04 FB: Do you feel like you still have any of that idealism?
00:10:06 LH: Yes, yeah, I think I have a lot of it, actually. Do I look like I do?
00:10:12 FB: [Laughs] I think so.
[Both laugh]
00:10:19 LH: Hasn't been beaten out of me.
00:10:21 FB: In what sort of ways do you, um, I mean, what sort of, could you maybe put into words what kind of, how exactly that idealism, how it manifests itself, in living at the co-ops, and what that meant to you.
00:10:36 LH: You mean back then, or how it's manifesting now?
00:10:38 FB: I mean both.
00:10:40 LH: Back then, it's the co-operative spirit, you know, cooking together, living together, helping each other out, hanging out together, doing music together, it was, that was, that was co-oping. And um, let's see, but I haven't lived like that in a while, last time I lived with three or four other unrelated people was about ten years ago. Once you have kids, that's it. No more. It just isn't, it's not practical. But it's a good way to live. I guess some friends of mine did have, um, did actually, this was in the, late seventies, did actually have a communal household, and grow their kids up together. But, after a while, it's just not feasible. I dunno what it is about kids, they're very, they make you very nuclear-centric. And that's not necessarily that good, but, that's the way it shakes up.
00:11:30 FB: So what, um, is there any thing, a factor you can identify that sort of shook your idealism from you, or at least—
00:11:38 LH: Oh, gettin' old. Gettin' old, having, well, I mean I think I'm still fairly idealistic, I still, you know I'm not a materialistic person. I try to do the best I can where I am. I'm a doctor, um, I worked in the health centers for fifteen years, before [Laughs] before I couldn't take it anymore. I work with underservant poor people and I think, you know, I think that's a good thing to do, yeah, so I think I probably still am idealistic. But in the communal way, I guess I contribute to the community, but not, not to the degree that I did when I was a co-oper.
00:12:16 FB: Mm-hmm
00:12:17 LH: Did that sound like schlock?
00:12:18 FB: No, nonono.
00:12:19 LH: Okay. [Laughing] Just wondering.
00:12:20 FB: It makes a lot of sense. Umm, so umm... what can I say? Umm...
00:12:35 LH: Now I remember about the, what was some very great things about the co-ops were those great food-buying expeditions to, like, is that place still there? That place, that giant warehouse where you could buy like crates and crates of really cheep fruit and peanut butter and cheese, is that place still there? Do they not? I thought it was condemned for some reason. Right across from where the Spaghetti factory used to be. Umm, there's like a, big warehouse.
00:13:02 FB: Ralph Calise? Do you call it "Docks"?
00:13:05 LH: No, is Calise's? There was a giant warehouse where you could buy giant amounts of food for really hungry college students.
00:13:12 [Both Laugh]
00:13:14 FB: This place is generally more, umm, we're the only students who buy there—
00:13:21 LH: Oh you're the only ones?
00:13:22 FB: I think so.
00:13:23 LH: No other houses do...
00:13:24 FB: I mean, ah, mean, the co-ops are the only one.
00:13:26 LH: Oh, oh.
00:13:26 FB: The only ones... like a wholesale, like food service and stuff.
00:13:29 LH: So there are no other groups of college students living communally and buying like huge wads of food in bulk, it's just the, just the two co-ops?
00:13:37 FB: Umm, there's the two co-ops and there's one that's owned by Brown called West House.
00:13:42 LH: Uh-huh. And are they [something] to the co-ops? Or, not necessarily.
00:13:46 FB: W-West House?
00:13:48 LH: Yeah, have you guys...
00:13:48 FB: Um, they're, they're independent. We're not, there's not as much of a connection between them, but, still in the same spirit.
00:13:57 [Awkward Pause.]
00:14:07 FB: So, um, you lived in the co-op your Junior year and then you left your Senior year.
00:14:16 LH: And then I lived off-campus. The old off-campus, you have to live off-campus at least once! [FB laughs]
00:14:23 FB: What made you decide to live off-campus?
00:14:26 LH: Oh boy. Uh, it might have been a space issue. I think in the co-ops, um, you had to have, uh, unless you had a high lottery number, or you were like, older than God, like there was one person who lived there, who'd been there for years and years, like a perennial student, um, and he, he had, you can get like a single, but mostly you have to have a double. Which is, just a space, privacy issue. And, ah, it's also to go out, rent a house with a bunch of your friends. Figure out how to do it. Part of the college, college experience. The transition to the world.
00:15:06 FB: After, after you graduated did you, did you experiment with living communally after that?
00:15:13 LH: Ahm, I didn't experiment, but I definitely did it. [Both laugh.] I did it a numbers of years, numbers of places. Ahm, not in Med school; in Med school I lived with my parents and I lived in the dorm. But after that, um, I lived with, I always live with housemates: when I was doing my residency, and then I moved back here, my sister and I had a house over in Bonnet Shores, which we had it, we had the best, we had the best coalition over there, we had, there was, there was: me, a single parent; her, her and her boyfriend, who are not married, living in sin; and our gay housemate, and we were like, "we really got the ticket here!" [Both laugh] Yeah, and it was a really small house, so, after a while, after the kid, the kids, kids require space, I dunno what it is. They require space and schedules. And quite, and not a lot of going in and out.
00:16:09 FB: So, so since you're, when did you, um, when did you move out of that situation? When was that?
00:16:16 LH: Uh, maybe a, maybe, it was about ten years ago.
00:16:21 FB: About ten years ago. So how old was, how old was Lucas then?
00:16:25 LH: Ah, Lucas is ten.
00:16:26 FB: He's ten now.
00:16:27 LH: Yes.
00:16:28 FB: Oh, okay. Do you, do you have any other children?
00:16:29 LH: No. [To LUCAS] Hey Lucas, sweetie, do you need a tissue? If you do could you go get one?
00:16:36 LUCAS: But I just used one.
00:16:38 LH: [Laughing, both laugh] Do you need another one? [Both laugh] If you do, it would be good to get one, so that... you're making lots of noise with your nose.
00:16:47 [Lucas sniffles loudly]
00:16:47 LH: [Sigh] [Laughing] What a poor tape recording, it'll never be the same.
00:16:52 FB: Oh, it's fine.
00:16:58 LH: Um, posterity, you're gonna go down in posterity as the boy who was blowing his nose to the Rhode Island Historical Society.
00:17:05 [FB laughs]
00:17:08 LH: Okay, listen, how's your reading going?
00:17:10 LUCAS: Good.
00:17:12 FB: What're you reading?
00:17:13 LUCAS: Did I [something] half an hour yet?
00:17:14 LH: NO. Definitely not. [FB laughs]
00:17:17 LUCAS: How do you know?
00:17:17 LH: Fokion wants to know what you're reading.
00:17:19 LUCAS: Ah, um, reading an "Oz Book".
00:17:24 FB: How is it?
00:17:26 LUCAS: It's good.
00:17:27 FB: What's it about?
00:17:28 LUCAS: Uh, [something] about the Wizard of Oz.
00:17:31 FB: Uh-huh.
00:17:32 LUCAS: It's the sequel to that one.
00:17:34 FB: Oh, cool.
00:17:37 LH: Did you ever read those?
00:17:39 FB: No, I never did.
00:17:41 LH: They're really good.
00:17:42 FB: I've never heard of them before, actually.
00:17:43 LH: There's, there's about ten of them.
00:17:44 FB: Wow.
00:17:45 LH: And they're not, umm...
00:17:47 FB: I can see, I see all of them on your shelf.
00:17:49 [Laughing]
00:17:49 LH: They're mine, I had them when I was little.
00:17:51 FB: Oh!
00:17:51 LH: They're not hokey, actually. They're great, they're like, in that one there's this great character called "The Woozie" who is, uh, he, he's completely square. There's not a curved surface on him. And he has a square head, square ears. ...Maybe his ears aren't square. Square body.
00:18:08 LUCAS: I betcha his eyeballs are square, too.
00:18:11 LH: I betcha his eyeballs are square, square tail, and he has, how many? he's got three hairs on the tip of his tail. [FB chuckles] And he breathes, what does he do? He breathes..
00:18:21 LUCAS: He doesn't breathe anything.
00:18:23 LH: Oh, he thinks he can breathe, he thinks he has a terrible roar, and he thinks he can breathe fire.
00:18:27 LUCAS: [Speaking over LH] And the roar's like "roar" [makes a pathetic roar.]
00:18:31 LH: The roar's like "eek." [Both laugh.]
00:18:33 LUCAS: The roar's like... "meeeeoooow!"
00:18:37 LH: He thinks he has a terrible roar and he thinks he can breathe fire, but really, he can only... does he breathe anything? Nothing really, no, nothing comes out.
00:18:43 LUCAS: No, he shoots sparks out of his eyes, though.
00:18:46 LH: He shoots sparks out of his eyes, yes. He's very fierce. [Laughs] There's some great characters in that book.
00:18:57 FB: So, umm, so when did you decide you wanted to be a doctor?
00:19:01 LH: Ahm, I went to Medical school, I decided to go to Medical school after I graduated from Brown I was working in a lab. Ah, in the Bio-Chemistry department, it was really boring. And so I thought, "well, I could really do this for the rest of my life, or, I, I, I don't have to, or..." I couldn't, so I just [something] and I had to take, a couple of courses I hadn't taken. I didn't take any biology courses [something]. At all. So I took three of those, and, that was fine.
00:19:31 FB: What, you took them... during your Senior year?
00:19:34 LH: No, I took them after I graduated from college.
00:19:37 FB: Oh, okay.
00:19:39 LH: I had a very, I had a very... um, one-sided curriculum, but there are so many requirements in the curriculum.
00:19:43 FB: —Yeah.
00:19:43 LH: Yeah. That's not good for people like me who really need to be a little more well-rounded. [FB laughs] Didn't take any...
00:19:51 FB: What kind of courses were you taking?
00:19:51 LH: Well, I took like twenty-five Chemistry courses, um, and...
00:19:55 FB: Why'd you do that?
00:19:56 LH: Because I like Chemistry. [Both laugh] I was a Chem major, so... I was [something] Chemistry. I have a chemical mind. But I didn't take any Biology. And, um, I didn't, I should have done more Liberal Arts. I should've branched out a bunch.
00:20:14 FB: So you, umm, so you mentioned your mother was a doctor?
00:20:19 LH: She was a nurse.
00:20:20 FB: A nurse. And your father was a Chemist?
00:20:21 LH: Yeah.
00:20:23 FB: So do you feel like it, it sort of runs in your family? Or is it...
00:20:27 LH: Huh... I don't know if that stuff runs in your, does it run in your family?
00:20:29 FB: I mean I know Philosophy runs in my family.
00:20:31 LH: Hmm... are your parents philosophers?
00:20:33 FB: Ah, my dad and my brother are both philosophers.
00:20:35 LH: Huh.
00:20:37 FB: And my mom's a mathematician, so...
00:20:39 LH: Hmm...
00:20:40 FB: Sort of,
00:20:41 LH: High cognition runs in your family.
00:20:42 FB: Trying, trying to stay away from both of those. [Laughs.]
00:20:45 LH: You might be doomed.[Both laugh.]
00:20:50 LH: Yeah, I wonder if that stuff runs, is it, if it's, you know, nature or nurture, or just what you're, is it just what you're exposed to. It's hard to say. It's also, pressure from the family.
00:21:00 FB: Was there pressure from your family?
00:21:02 LH: Not explicit, no. It's probably quite, there was probably a lot, probably a lot of [something] "Well she graduated from college, she's hanging around a lab, what's she gonna do? She's gotta do something." So yeah, but I don't think they actually ever said anything. They just, look at me with that long, suffering look. [Both Laugh.] What're you gonna do in your year off, do you know, or?
00:21:25 FB: Uh, my semester off? I...
00:21:27 LH: It's just a semester?
00:21:28 FB: I m-, I might take a, I dunno, uh, I'm not really sure, actually. Umm, I might, umm, I might do what I'm doing right now, trying to track down some old co-opers, see what they're up to.
00:21:43 LH: Would you like the names of all of my friends? They're probably, they're probably on the list, you have the database?
00:21:47 FB: Um, yeah, I do, actually, but if you'd like to give me, give me some names, that would be great.
00:21:53 LH: Am I the only one in this area, that you could find?
00:21:55 FB: Um, that responded in time, yeah, but there's a few people in Providence.
00:22:03 LH: Are there some in Providence?, they must be younger. They left; they couldn't be older.
00:22:07 FB: No, there's actually, there's, I got in touch with somebody who was in the co-ops in the mid-70s.
00:22:13 LH: Hm! Still alive? [Both Laugh] Not dead, not deceased from smoking all that pot? [Both Laugh] Ah, mid-70s.
00:22:26 FB: So, um, so when you be-, when you became a doctor, what was it that compelled you to become a doctor?
00:22:32 LH: Uhh... what compelled me? Uhh... I [something] I thought that I was compelled, I mean, I think it's a reasonable thing to do, if you're not completely taken or, or obsessed with something else in particular. It's a reasonable field. Umm... the pay is, not great, the hours... stink, umm... the people are fun. It's a reasonable thing to do with your life, if you have no big calling.
00:23:08 FB: So you, umm... do you feel like your idealism has anything to do with, uh...
00:23:17 LH: Well, I mean, I don't think I could be um, I don't think I would be a really good business person, because, you know, money— I just actually opened my own business, just now.
00:23:27 FB: Oh wow.
00:23:27 LH: I know, it's very, something. Just, in September, I opened my own practice which is very, rather shocking. Actually I have another business. Which I opened two years ago, which is a plant business. Umm, I have a, plant locating and advising service. But that's not [unintelligible, LH and FB speaking over each other] Yes, it's called "Plant This". So, um, so uh [FB chuckles] So people say, "what should I put here?" and I tell them "ooh, this one." I tell them what I should plant there, and um, and uh, I sometimes get it for them.
00:24:04 FB: Oh, and like, for their gardens or something?
00:24:06 LH: Yes, yeah.
00:24:07 FB: So that's how you have, why you have such a nice garden?
00:24:09 LH: Yes, did you see my garden?
00:24:10 FB: Yeah, it's really impressive.
00:24:11 LH: Really? Uh. You liked it? That's good.
00:24:13 FB: It's a very, it's very unique.
00:24:16 LH: It's a bit messy. It's very, I didn't have time to work on it this year or last year. I actually just moved into this house like two years ago. It's a brand new house, so, uh, the whole yard was, uh, trashed.
00:24:28 FB: Mmm, [mumbles]
00:24:29 [Some noise, probably Lucas playing with something.]
00:24:30 LH: I was in this house before that, and I knocked it down; it's a long story. I knocked it down in '97. I bought it, in ninety-[something] and then I knocked it down in 2001. And rebuilt it in 2003.
00:24:44 FB: Was it on this lot?
00:24:45 LH: It was right here, right on this, right on the same footprint. Umm, except it didn't have that front sunroom,
00:24:52 FB: So the house that was a mess was the one that you knocked down?
00:24:55 LH: Well it wasn't really a mess.
00:24:57 FB: But you said the front lawn was a mess, or something or other...
00:25:00 LH: Well after they did the house, they had to run over every square inch with a zillion giant trucks and
00:25:04 FB: Why did you decide to, knock it down?
00:25:07 LH: [sigh] well I didn't, I didn't really, I was planning, I was trying to put an addition on for my dad, because he was sick, and he, he umm, he couldn't live, he couldn't've lived in his house by himself, so actually we had to move in there, but, it was, he ended up dying and um, and, when I had actually started knocking it down, then the, then ah, I'd do it too soon because it turned out they couldn't actually build on the same foundation because the foundation was so rotten, but it was already gutted, so, it was a terrible disaster. But anyway, the house is, this house is very new; it's not messy right now.
00:25:44 [Both Laugh.]
00:25:47 LH: It took, yeah, it's a long, a long sad house story, so, yeah, I was trying to make the house handicap-accessible for my father. It was a little tiny house, it was here, it was, it was on the same footprint. But it didn't have, was it on the same footprint? yes, it didn't have, um, this is a little tiny summer house, it had like, em, like a stair, right in the front and no, it couldn't, you couldn't maneuver a wheelchair in it, so yes, you have to.
00:26:19 FB: So, umm, ahm... Forgot what I was asking you... Umm...
00:26:29 LH: The house—Oh the business, okay, so—
00:26:31 FB: —the business, yeah!—
00:26:31 LH: —I started a new business, and, um, yes, I am not monetarily inclined, so, it will probably be a disaster [laughs] it might not be. We'll see.
00:26:41 FB: So, you're starting your own practice?
00:26:42 LH: I did, yeah, I started it in, ah Wickford.
00:26:45 FB: W-what compelled you to do that?
00:26:47 LH: Well, I was working for the health centers and actually, um, I was really badly treated at a couple of different health centers. I was at one for about, about twelve years, in Pawtucket, and the administration is bad. They were bad. They were, they were disrespectful, they were rude, they didn't know how to run a health center, so we actually all left in a big mass. Probably, there were three really bad administrators, each successively worse. The first one was a little nutty. The second one was, um, uhh, the second one was a letch, and he was, he was really, he was an alcoholic and he was really dumb. The third one was an interim and he was great, but he only stayed for a year. The fourth one, is a complete disaster, the place is [FB chuckles, LH chuckles] the place is gone to rack and ruin, umm, we all, we were a bunch of doctors there that had been there for maybe more than, more than five or ten years, unusual for a health center. Um, we all actually left after that because we couldn't stand it anymore.
00:27:52 FB: So you all started your own practice?
00:27:54 LH: No, everyone dispersed, umm, so one other person moved to another health center. I moved to another health center but that place was also... I think this, I don't know what it is about administrators, I think they just don't, they don't, um, I don't know how they can be so, something... Now what's really good about this practice is that I can... I run it, so, if something isn't working, I fix it, right there. [Laughs] If I see there's a problem with it, I, I try to think of something that, that will, um, correct it. [Something] but, I dunno the systems, I guess it's systems and having a lot of people, it's just hard to... make people do what you want. Maybe I was part of the... blockage there. The health centers are unfortunately quite badly run. Umm, but the population is good, I mean, I actually had, I really work there forever if I hadn't been essentially run out of my job, in Pawtucket, that one. I would've been there forever. Um, so, it's sad I mean, I felt sad when I was leaving the health centers, but, I just couldn't take it anymore. I- I guess, I guess, maybe twenty every, you know, fifteen years, that's enough to, that's enough if you, that's enough to, to put it in um, feel like you're, you're giving a donation, of yourself. I- If it... yeah. But it's hard.
00:29:15 FB: So, um, so how'd you come up with the idea for the, uh, the plant business?
00:29:21 LH: Oh well I'm a plant nut. [Both Laugh] Um, and, my friends are always asking me, what they should plant in various places, and if I, if I had a company actually I could get this discount from this really great nursery, I could get the wholesaler's discount. So I would, um, I would take all their orders, or ask what they wanted, and I would go and do this giant, a couple of runs in the spring, and just, um, bring people their plants. Get my own, too. Actually that business, umm, made money, it made fifty dollars last year.
00:29:57 FB: Wow. [Both laugh]
00:29:58 LH: But the year before it lost, it lost, seventy, so, it's not bad. [Both laugh]
00:30:05 LH: Yeah, yeah so money's not in my cards.
00:30:13 FB: So, um, so how do you, um, what is, ah, I mean, looking back on your experience in the co-ops, what is the most memorable thing you take from it?
00:30:29 LH: Hmm... I think before feeling of umm... of young people able to do almost anything they want when they're, when they're in a group, they can do it. They can do it, even though they're nuts. You know what, I guess lots of people who live near it would say, "Wow, are they crazy?" But, no, they can do it. It's that young, idealism thing. ... The most important thing... I guess that would be it.
00:31:01 FB: If, umm... mm... so, umm, is that, I mean... do you miss it?
00:31:16 LH: Mmm... no. No, I'm old now. You get older, you... there's a, there's a, there's a time, when you should do it, I think it should be a formative experience or a deformative experience in everyone's life. [Both laugh.] But no, no I don't, but actually, what I think got me the most was actually it was, really, unsanitary. There was a pig living in the basement. Umm, along with, umm, any number of unfed dogs, and maybe fourteen or so cats, maybe not fourteen, but there were seven or eight cats. Which was just, I think it probably, it was probably hazardous, um, in terms of just the, just the, just the catbox itself would be, was, was really a bad thing. But the food was really good. And, um, I did bake, I did bake the bread for the co-op and that was great, all that, all that kneading is good for you. And umm, when I lived there there was a gigantic, that was the year there was a giant blizzard, was it '87 or '88 or '89 I can't remember. Um, and, I remember people, jumping out of the second floor of Milhouse into these giant snowdrifts, so, maybe from like as high as that window there, into these, I think they were 10 or 12 foot high snowdrifts. They were great.
00:32:40 LUCAS: 10 or 12 what?
00:32:42 LH: 10 or 12 foot high snowdrifts, there was a giant blizzard. It was very exciting.
00:32:47 FB: That's amazing. [FB laughs]
00:32:50 LH: What year was that, I can't remember, seventy-something. There was a very big blizzard that year. They had to, the National Guard came out and they closed, everything was closed. They had to use giant tractors to plow the street, or, something.
00:33:05 FB: That's amazing
00:33:06 LH: Yeah, it was a good snow storm. Don't get too many like that.
00:33:12 FB: So, um, do you remember anything of the tension between BACH and the Brown Administration?
00:33:19 LH: No, I remember hearing more about it not when I was there but later on. I mean, there, there were always, there was always a threat of the Fire Marshall coming, for some reason, and then whenever the Fire Marshall came we had to [laughs] remove the 72 violations that we had there, and there were always, whoever was doing the administration would be walking around saying, walking around looking at the house saying "oh, we gotta fix that!", "oh we gotta get rid of that crack", "oh we gotta put these lights up here". Um, and that would go on, that actually went on a lot.
00:33:56 FB: So, umm, but you said you weren't involved with the Board, or the administration or anything. [LUCAS says something in the background]
00:34:02 LH: No, I didn't, I didn't— did you finish reading?
00:34:04 LUCAS: Yes.
00:34:04 LH: Yes, okay. Twenty minutes, no more. Twenty minutes, the buzzer's gonna ring. That's it, not, until nine o'clock, okay.
00:34:10 [Pause. LUCAS walks up stairs.]
00:34:14 LH: Twenty minutes.
00:34:17 LUCAS: I haven't started yet.
00:34:17 LH: Okay.
00:34:19 LUCAS: So, it will probably be 'till nine-o-one.
00:34:22 LH: Okay, nine-o-one.
00:34:24 LUCAS: nine-o-two!
00:34:27 LH: Okay, nine-o-two.
00:34:27 LUCAS: nine-o-three?
00:34:28 LH: No, no.
00:34:29 LUCAS: [Laughs] There's supposed to be a lunar eclipse at 10.
00:34:35 LH: I don't know if you can stay up that late.
00:34:36 LUCAS: I can stay up that late. I never go to sleep early. It's a piece of cake.
00:34:48 LH: I'm sorry, what were you saying?
00:34:49 FB: I was just saying that, um, you said that you weren't involved with the administration.
00:34:55 LH: Yeah, no, I didn't do any of that.
00:34:57 FB: Alight, alright, what, what was your house job?
00:35:02 LH: I was a bread-baker.
00:35:03 FB: Oh that was your house job.
00:35:03 LH: Did you guys have, do you have a bread-baker now?
00:35:05 FB: No, we, we, uh, we dumpster our bread. [Laughs]
00:35:09 LH: What do you do?
00:35:10 FB: We dumpster-dive our bread.
00:35:11 LH: Oh.
00:35:12 FB: Or go to stores before they're closing.
00:35:14 LH: Oh, huh.
00:35:15 FB: Take, take the bread from the end of the day.
00:35:18 LH: Huh. Interested, okay. Oh, "dumpster diving", is that what you said?
00:35:21 FB: Yeah.
00:35:22 LH: Okay. [FB laughs, LH laughs.] Huh, it's good to have baked bread, it would actually disappear really quickly, though. I would make, like, a large number of loaves, it would [laughs] pretty much be gone instantaneously. [FB laughs] And, oh, boy the, the, do you guys have bins for grains?
00:35:43 FB: Uh, we have big buckets, now.
00:35:45 LH: Uh-huh. Another, another, sanitation disaster. [Laughs] Um, yeah, Milhouse used to have these giant wooden bins,
00:35:55 FB: Ohhh, ohhh...
00:35:55 LH: that someone made for...
00:35:58 FB: Ohhh... grain moths?
00:35:58 LH: Yes. Yes. It was the home of, the mother of all grain moths. [FB cringes] But it had these giant, giant bins where, all kinds, and they were always, they were always full of moths, and uh, but they were always full of giant amounts of flour and oats and, yeah.
00:36:16 FB: Yeah, we, uh, we've had, we've had some bug problems. You guys have any, like, mouse or rat problems or anything?
00:36:26 LH: With those cats? My god. [Both laugh] I remember, do you have cats in your...?
00:36:31 FB: No, we don't.
00:36:32 LH: You're not allowed to, or...?
00:36:32 FB: We don't have any, we don't have any pets right now. One of the housemates is allergic.
00:36:38 LH: Oh, okay.
00:36:38 FB: But we, one person has a one-eyed hairless rat.
00:36:42 LH: One-eyed hairless rat? Do they breed them that way? [FB laughs] They usually have two-eyes.
00:36:45 FB: Not one-eyed. [Laughs]
00:36:47 LH: What happened to his eye, poor thing?
00:36:49 FB: Uhh, he got in a fight with another rat.
00:36:51 LH: Maybe it's Clooney, oh, do you know, did you read the Red Wall books?
00:36:54 FB: No...
00:36:55 LH: You didn't read all these, how did you, how did you grow up avoiding all these really good books? [FB Chuckles] You probably read other things. Did you read the Tom Swift series?
00:37:02 FB: No.
00:37:03 LH: No? What did you read when you were little?
00:37:06 FB: Choose Your Own Adventure, Wayside School books...
00:37:09 LH: I don't know those! How old were you? Maybe they are, maybe you, oh maybe that's why, you're young.
00:37:14 FB: I'm nineteen.
00:37:15 LH: Uh-huh. Choose Your Own Adventure... Wayside...
00:37:18 FB: Wayside School.
00:37:19 LH: I'm gonna have to look for those. Is that all one series? Are they good?
00:37:22 FB: No, two different, two different, Choose Your Own Adventure, you turn from page to, you're, telling a story. And you wanna decide where you wanna go in the story, and you get to choose what happens by turning to certain pages.
00:37:33 LH: Hmm... is there a whole series?
00:37:34 FB: Yeah, they're really, really fun.
00:37:37 LH: Okay. Are they written by any particular person?
00:37:40 FB: I don't remember.
00:37:41 LH: Okay.
00:37:41 FB: There's small ones that are like, for younger kids, that are the red cover, and then there's more like, ahh, longer-sized books that're for older kids.
00:37:52 LH: Huh, never heard of them. I'll have to go to the bookstore.
00:37:55 FB: Definitely.
00:37:56 LH: And, what is Wayside?
00:37:56 FB: Wayside School.
00:37:58 LH: What's that about?
00:37:58 FB: It's about this crazy school that was built wrong and all these weird things happen.
00:38:02 LH: Oh [laughs]. It's a series?
00:38:05 FB: Yeah.
00:38:07 LH: Hmm, well that's interesting, I'll have to look for those. Maybe, is Lucas the right age for them?
00:38:12 FB: Umm, let's see, you said he's 10?
00:38:13 LH: Ten, uh-huh.
00:38:13 FB: Oh, definitely.
00:38:14 LH: Okay.
00:38:15 FB: Definitely, yeah.
00:38:17 LH: Are they in the Library?
00:38:18 FB: Probably, I haven't been to the... Library much.
00:38:23 LH: Oh, huh. You have to go to the Library. The Library is key here. Huh, no, so with the cats, yes, there were no rodent problems. Yeah, cats are, animals are part of co-op life. [FB laughs.] I think someone actually had a, did someone have a monkey? [FB laughs] There was someone who had a monkey. It was a very animaliferous few years when I was there.
00:38:45 FB: Oh, that's wonderful. We have so few animals in the house.
00:38:49 LH: Well, they all, the, animals are great but you have to clean up after them. [Both laugh] Yeah, they're, I've contributed to the problem, I had a cat, but, um, I did try to do something to that cat box. [Both laugh] It was really bad. [Sigh]
00:39:07 FB: So is it a, was it a strange transition process moving from, from the dorms to the co-ops, or was it...
00:39:14 LH: Uhm... Well Sod house was kind of a weird dorm anyway. It was, it was just a, it wasn't like your, it wasn't like, on the quad or anything.
00:39:22 FB: What street was it on?
00:39:23 LH: It's right, um, right now it's some other, I drive by there...
00:39:27 FB: Is it on Hope and Benevolent?
00:39:30 LH: It's on Hope and I don't know the little street that it's on, it's a little tiny street. And, if the Fox Point Daycare Center is here it's on the same block.
00:39:37 FB: Hmm...
00:39:37 LH: There's that playground, and then there's a house around the corner there. It used to be yellow, but, with big white columns.
00:39:43 FB: Umm, 'cause there's a house there, King House, is on Hope and Benevolent, and it's a co-ed literary fraternity.
00:39:53 LH: Co-ed, literary? Isn't that an oxymoron? [Laughs] Literary fraternity?
00:39:59 LH: Is it the only one of its kind? [FB laughs] In the country?
00:40:01 FB: Probably. It is a national organization.
00:40:04 LH: Oh it is? Hmm, um, okay. Well, uh I think it could be in that house, King House. Yes, that house. Yeah, it has this little solarium on it. [Something] Oh, a solarium is a sun room.
00:40:18 FB: Uh-huh, a what?
00:40:20 LH: A sun room. On the [something] one side, in the back, somewhere. Somewhere there. Um, how is frat and sorority life on campus? Is it burgeoning?
00:40:34 FB: Umm, It's hard to tell because when you live in the co-ops it's very easy to ignore.
00:40:39 LH: Oh, that's the good thing about the co-ops. [Both laugh] It's definitely insular. You think that everyone is as nuts as you and, but you know there are [something] some people are very, very mainstream.
00:40:55 FB: Would you consider yourself, umm, not mainstream?
00:40:59 LH: Oh, I'm not. I, I know. I've come to accept that fact about myself. I know I'm out there on the bell curve. I think I'm very reasonable. Do I seem like a normal person? [FB laughs]
00:41:14 FB: I'm not sure how to answer that question. No, I don't think so.
00:41:17 LH: Yeah, I don't think I am either, I really can't tell because I only have myself to reference, but, I would say that I'm not normal.
00:41:23 FB: It's a hard question to answer.
00:41:24 LH: Yeah, 'cause, cause you, really, yourself, you are your, you are the center of your own world, so.
00:41:31 FB: So what did you, what did you do in your year off?
00:41:34 LH: Umm, I worked for the EPA, in New Jersey, in, umm, Edison, I did a Coop. A coop? What did I do? I did a coop, there.
00:41:44 FB: You mean you lived in a co-op?
00:41:46 LH: Um, no, they call it a coop semester, or coop year, just where you, you work, and they pay you, and you fulfill the functions of the job. As I worked, I guess, in the testing division in, where was it, Raritan depot, do you know where that is? It's near out, what's that big university there? It's near that university.
00:42:10 FB: Princeton?
00:42:11 LH: No no, the other one.
00:42:13 FB: Rutgers?
00:42:14 LH: Rutgers, yeah. Yeah, just north of Rutgers. It's not a very usual part of the state, but they have a need for the EPA there.
00:42:30 FB: That's New Jersey. ... So umm, how did you, how did you feel that, um, how did you decide to take the year off?
00:42:43 LH: Now I can't remember why I did at that point. Maybe I wasn't sure what I was, what was I doing. What was I doing? What am I doing now? Um, I'm not sure why. Maybe I wasn't sure about my major, what I wanted to do. When I came back I don't think I was sure either, so...
00:43:00 FB: Do you feel like it was, it um, it changed you as a person, do you feel like it had any sort of influence on you?
00:43:08 LH: No, I don't think it changed me a lot because, umm, when I went, I wasn't sure, when I came back, I wasn't sure, umm, but I did know I didn't like New Jersey a lot, and I still didn't mind working in labs, but I think a year is good for maturity, like, I think, some people are not, are late matures, like I think I am, um, I don't know. And, I think when you're near that age, you know, I've met some kids that are really mature, and others that are, really, sort of, are not, and I think it just takes, it's a time thing. When you, when you're, it just takes some time. Yeah I don't think, I don't think it changed me particularly. My mom was glad 'cause I was closer to home.
00:43:57 FB: So, um, um, do you feel like, do you feel like living in the co-op had a profound lasting influence on you?
00:44:04 LH: I think it just aggravated those, those tendencies to lean Leftward [Both Laugh]. As you could say, it probably deformed me even more. [Both Laugh] But, um, yeah.
00:44:19 FB: Were you, were you politically active at Brown?
00:44:21 LH: No, not really. No, but I pretty much always know where I stand. And, um maybe I should be more active in getting other people to stand, so I stand—
00:44:33 FB: So where do you stand?
00:44:33 LH: Oh, umm... somewhere to the Left of Center, pretty far to the Left.
00:44:37 FB: What does that mean for you?
00:44:38 LH: Umm, well I hate to use that word, that terrible "L" word, that word that people accuse other people of being. I'm probably one of those. Not Libertarian. [FB laughs] And I think other things have contributed to that too because I'm a, I guess I'm a child of immigrants. And I'm from New York. What can you expect? And then I'm a single parent. And so, which, you know, gives you a different perspective, on, um, on the world. When you're coming from a place which is not, generally respected. So, I think part of that is, and I don't, um, I don't know if the co-op actually had much to do with those things.
00:45:30 FB: So, what kind of, what kind of issues did you feel that, as being a child of immigrants, how did that, how did that affect you?
00:45:38 LH: Well that's just, that's a different thing altogether. It's just when you're, when you grow up, you just realize you're different, you look different, your cultures are different, ahm, you're, you're just not, you're not mainstream, you don't see you on TV. Umm, you're not what people should aspire to look like or be or anything like that. Yeah, that puts you in a different place. If you, if you go, you should go somewhere where you're, where you're the minority and then, that's that feeling. Umm, it's always good to know what that feeling is like. I, I would think that most white males have no idea.
00:46:23 FB: I would agree.
00:46:24 LH: Ha- have you had, have you gone, if you go to a different country, um, you can get that feeling of being different and looked at, but, but you're still, in other places you're still respected, but, if you're, if you were a black person in a white country, well you're looked at, but you're not respected, so it's, it's a different, yeah. ... And, I realize, and I always felt it but I didn't realize what it, what that was until I actually went to China where I looked just like everyone else, no one looked at me and it was like, "this is interesting" and you'd see a Caucasian walk down the street and you'd look at them! That was really interesting for me, and I realized that is, that's a strong influence.
00:47:04 FB: When did you go to China?
00:47:05 LH: I went, um, I've been twice. I went when I was in Medical school. I won the lottery, God. I won, there's a trip, a free trip to China for two students and, to go study at Beijing University at, uh, one of the hospitals there, so, unbelievably enough, I won the lottery. So I went for a Semester.
00:47:28 FB: How was, how was ah, how did you feel in China, did you feel like you identified with the culture?
00:47:33 LH: No, not at all, unfortunately, because, I'm clearly American in my, in my Left-leaning tendencies, but, um, so I did have that mindset, it's a completely different mindset, but at least I looked the same, although I was fatter, you know, everyone there was so skinny. And I wore weird clothes. But I could get clothes like that and look just like everyone else and if I didn't open my mouth, no one would know, it was great. I think it was like my sister, went to, ah, Hawaii recently and she, she had the same kind of feeling, she was like, "Everyone looks like me there!" She was really happy about that.
00:48:08 FB: When was the other time you went to China?
00:48:10 LH: I went, um, a couple years ago before my dad died, he wanted to, he graduated from, um, a university in China, actually a fairly, it's a pretty well known university, he arranged.
00:48:23 FB: What's the name of the university?
00:48:24 LH: [something] University. He should have a really big, uh, reunion, so he had, he threw this giant party for his class, of which there were only, there were not many people left. I think there were ten. Um, and then, the subsidiaries, but, so, we, we actually went with him 'cause he was, he was actually pretty sick by that time. So, we wanted to make sure that he could be, we could carry his luggage for him. So, we all went.
00:48:49 FB: What part of China were your parents from?
00:48:52 LH: Uh, my dad is from Canton and my mom was from Hong Kong.
00:48:57 FB: Have you been, have you been to those places?
00:48:59 LH: Have I been where?
00:49:00 FB: Have you been to either Canton or Hong Kong?
00:49:01 LH: Yes, when we went to China, I traveled down to Canton. I actually met my mom there. I met her in Peking and she traveled along and I met her and my aunt in, in Canton, then we went to Hong Kong. Yeah, I've been there. Umm, have you been, where have you been?
00:49:19 FB: I've been to umm, I've been to, to Greece, because that's where my mom's from...
00:49:26 LH: Is that where your name is from?
00:49:27 FB: Mm-hm. Umm, and I've been to, ah, France, the UK, umm, uhh, Denmark once when I was very little. I went to Legoland.
00:49:43 LH: Legoland. I [something] that.
00:49:49 FB: Oh, I've been to Canada. That, that may be it. I've always wanted to go to China, though.
00:49:54 LH: It's funny, though, I've actually gone to like a pile of third world countries but I've never been to, I've never been to, um, Europe.
00:50:00 FB: Yeah, I wanna, I wanna go somewhere other than Europe.
00:50:03 LH: Huh, yeah, well, it's cheaper to go places other than Europe. That's where I've always been. So I've been to a lot of places in Latin America.
00:50:11 FB: I, I'm dying to go to China.
00:50:13 LH: Huh, you should go then 'cause it's quite interesting. It's a giant mass of humanity. It's shocking when you see those strings of bicyclists during rush hour. It's really shocking. It's just a huge ribbon of... oh boy, there a lot of people over there.
00:50:30 FB: So did you feel, how did you feel about, um, as, as a daughter of immigrants did you feel that, um, did you, did you feel that, how did you feel that put you in the co-ops versus, like did you feel more comfortable in the co-ops than in the dorms, or did it not really matter, or were you comfortable with it?
00:50:48 LH: Well, I think Brown is a really diverse community, and I think it didn't, didn't really matter, umm, 'cause Brown is, to its credit it really has a lot of, has, well, it has a huge Asian population which is the first thing. Um, it must, is it like ten percent? It's pretty high.
00:51:05 FB: I don't know the number.
00:51:06 LH: It's high; there are Asians around there. The more, I think there were more now than there used to be on some, those Asians are like, always prepping their kids.
00:51:17 FB: So, um, so as, as a, so you felt, so you felt comfortable in the co-ops.
00:51:24 LH: Yeah, in the, in the, you know there actually there weren't a lot of Asians in the co-ops because, Asians are, you know, they often follow their stereotype. Not always, but they're often fairly... they're more mainstream? Or, is that true or am I just being that way? I can't really tell.
00:51:45 FB: Umm, I dunno.
00:51:47 LH: Yeah, I dunno either, yeah.
00:51:52 FB: So you felt, did that make you feel, sort of, alienated at all, did you not feel...
00:51:57 LH: No, because I've always been my own. My own something, whatever that is, I know where I am. Just the way it is.
00:52:10 FB: So if, ah, it's, ah, it's very interesting, um, ah, comparing, um, the Brown Co-ops with, compared to other schools, where the Co-ops haven't functioned, just wondering if you have any idea, what it might be about Brown that made the co-ops function so well.
00:52:35 LH: Do they function well?
00:52:36 FB: [Laughs] They still exist.
00:52:39 LH: They must be functioning well. Umm, I think Brown, Brown is probably a more open and diverse– but are they not doing well in other places? Are there not any other co-ops?
00:52:48 FB: There's other, there's other schools where, you know, they create a co-op for five years and then it doesn't exist anymore, 'cause it completely collapses.
00:52:55 LH: Huh... Is there a strong recruitment going on for, for the co-op?
00:53:00 FB: Actually most people on campus don't know we exist.
00:53:03 LH: Really?
00:53:03 FB: Yeah. How was it, how was it then? Were people aware of the co-ops?
00:53:09 LH: I think so because I knew about them and I wasn't, umm, I mean you could see them, they were obviously there on campus, I, maybe they're more peripheral now, they probably are. The actual buildings are more peripheral. But I mean you could always see like zillions of umm, unwashed, unshaven people hanging out on those really old sofas, playing guitar, which, it looked qualitatively certainly different from hanging out in front of Apple- Apple, what's the name of that dorm? Apple... the one across the way from, um, Milhouse... Is it called Applebee? Apple-something... Appledoor, Appledum.
00:53:44 FB: Young Orchard?
00:53:45 LH: Young Orchard? Nonono, there's that really ugly dorm right across from where Milhouse and Carberry used to be.
00:53:52 FB: Hmm...
00:53:52 LH: Mmkay, maybe it's not there anymore.
00:53:53 FB: Grad Center?
00:53:54 LH: No, nono. Uh, is it, Young Orchard was, where those other apartments. No one did any hanging out at Young Orchard.
00:54:01 FB: The co-ops were on Charlesfield Street.
00:54:04 LH: Which one?
00:54:05 FB: Charlesfield.
00:54:06 LH: Charlesfield, yeah. So there was a dorm, a big dorm that takes up most of the other side of the street.
00:54:12 FB: I actually haven't visited the old buildings.
00:54:15 LH: Huh, you should look at them. Are they still, what are they being used for now?
00:54:18 FB: Nothing.
00:54:19 LH: Nothing?
00:54:20 FB: From what I hear they're just abandoned buildings that Brown owns.
00:54:24 LH: Why? I mean, they're so pushed for space there.
00:54:27 FB: They own lots of abandoned buildings.
00:54:29 LH: But right on campus there? I mean it's right in the middle of...
00:54:31 FB: There's, there's also an abandoned building they own that's around Waterman street.
00:54:36 LH: Oh, interesting. What are they doing? What are they doing with all my money? [FB laughs]
00:54:43 FB: Clearly not doing anything with the abandoned co-op.
00:54:48 LH: Are they just not up to code? Is that the problem?
00:54:50 FB: I have no idea.
00:54:54 FB: So, umm... [awkward pause] trying to think of something to say...
00:55:11 LH: Alright well lemmie go roust that kid and make him go to bed.
00:55:12 FB: Okay.
00:55:14 LH: You can think of any, questions that you... you want some more tea?
00:55:15 FB: Umm, sure, I'd love some.
00:55:20 [Recording Clipped while LH puts LUCAS to bed.] FB: Umm, so umm, was there anything more, anything that, umm, thing that you'd like to talk about? Anything more you remember about the co-ops that you'd like to talk about?
00:55:37 LH: There was a really great loft in Milhouse in the, um, bedroom on the left. Is it still there? It was, umm, my friends built it, and it was, it was The Loft, the mother of all lofts, and it had, umm, it had two parts to it, a walkway and a desk underneath it. [Laughs] I think that was it.
00:56:07 FB: You think that's it?
00:56:08 LH: That's it.
00:56:09 FB: Okay.